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Are Liverpool really triple champions?
I’ve noticed a lot of LFC supporters claiming that Liverpool are English, European and World champions. When does the ability to lay claim to those titles expire though? They’re out of the champions league, surely a defeated champion cannot claim to still be champion? By the same token they have no chance of winning the club world cup this season therefore should not be referred to as World Champs.
I suppose league winners are champions till the next team are crowned. But in cup competitions, can you be referred to as champion after being knocked out of the cup?
Raoul, Sunny South Africa
Writing in to let people know how ecstatic I am about the Liverpool premier league win, whatever the future holds I will definitely enjoy this moment along with last years champions leagues win.
– This websites sister once put Jurgen Klopp at 10th behind Mourinho for managers to have a pint with, predictable or not, Jurgen is number 1 on that list, go see his dance moves, tell me I am wrong, since that day all your opinion pieces have been highly divisive, maybe correcting this wrong will re-align your matrix.
– Every week we get a piece on the death of some aspect of football, we get it, you hate football, or you hate loving football, or you hate hating football or just you confused and no longer no what you want, can we just maybe not have this for 2 weeks, it goes from interesting opinion piece, to Terminator Genesis levels of contrite really fast.
– To all the rival fans, unlucky, good luck for next year, I hope all clubs (including Pool) spend responsibly in the market, we do not need a 2 billion pound transfer window after a pandemic.
– To united fans, We won, we not at war, but we won, I got 1/13 years of torment back, I hope for another 12 years of pain for you.
– To city fans, I hope you are still banned, goodluck for the champions league, may it come home for you in this new format, I think its your best shot, but you should be banned.
– To all clubs who are waiting for their first silverware or just hoping to break a barren spell, have a leciester moment for me, thanks, I know the feeling of winning now, may you all get a chance one day ( just whenever you win the league we will take a champs league to even it up)
– I finally don’t need to play FM manager to see this, can Steven gerrard be signed for 7 games ?
I’ll admit the Theatre of Dreams thing is a bit cringey but its nothing compared to the This Means More motto.
The Theatre of Dreams is specifically a nickname for Old Trafford dreamt up my the marketing wonks at United. Its purpose is to associate a sense of prestige and wonder with visiting the stadium, very useful when selling tickets to tourists, signing sponsors, and promoting matches.
Liverpool’s motto much like ‘Mes Que Un Club’ at Barcelona is a statement of superiority above all other clubs and all other fans. No matter what any other club achieves, they are inferior because ‘This means more’. No matter how much you love and support your team you’ll never match the passion of our fans because ‘This means more’. Real Madrid’s 13 European cups is a lesser achievement than Liverpool’s 6 because ‘This means more’. It’s self-aggrandising to the extreme, arrogance beyond belief, and it reflects the rhetoric of your fans so well, that you are superior.
So no, its not just a marketing gimmick. It’s an ethos of your club and fanbase that FSG are now publicising for profits.
Current number one British manager…
Just finished watching the Leicester v Chelsea quarter final . I have to put my hands up and admit I did not reckon on Fat Frank having such a succesful start at the sharp end of English football management . So I must congratulate him on what he has achieved so far .
I am imagining Brendan Rodgers is feeling rather bitter at the idea that he isn´t the number one British manager at this time . On an entertaining note I heard the commentator get 2 juicy lines into his commentary.
Using Ndidi of the Foxes and Kepa . The first was “Indeed he …did well….” . The second was “..to cep a really good week for Chelsea….” . Smiles all round . The other ponderance that came from the game was who would Terry pick if given the job of scouting the best up and coming central defender for his beloved blues . And my long term disgruntlement , the cheek of a player called Loftus not playing for QPR .
Over to Spain and my comment to my La Liga loving friends that the minute Barcelona sacked Enesto Valverde they gift wrapped the title to the merengues seems to be coming to bitter fruition .
Peter (hoping for a United – City FA cup final where Ole´s team win coz City go down to 9 men ). Andalucia
Tim Sutton stirred the hornets nest with his incendiary observation that Liverpool are “only getting worse”. The reality is that it’s almost inevitable that he will be able to evidence he “was right” next year, and probably can now.
Last year Liverpool won the Champions League whilst amassing a remarkable 97 points. This year they may only improve on their League performance by a few points whilst not winning the Champions League. If you’re in the mood, you could argue this is worse.
Now imagine next season. Liverpool lose two games (they’re rubbish), win only 96 ponies, don’t win the league, and only make it to the semi-final of the Champions League. The Tim’s off the world will quickly be pointing out how poor Liverpool have been.
The reality is the bar that’s been set is ridiculous, unheard of before Pep’s reign at City. That Liverpool have risen to the challenge is truly remarkable and maintaining near on perfection impossible.
Liverpool may be “worse” next season, but that will be a reflection on this year and last.
PS as I’ve written before, when I left Barcelona last year I thought the dream was over, and the performance levels could not be maintained. I was very wrong. Who knows what will come next.
Reply so Tim who hates Liverpool so much more than any other football team who has ever won the premier league no matter what.
It’s your hate man, enjoy. I’ll just enjoy my amazing football team winning team winning the title and champions league.
See now we’re both happy.
This is an email from an Evertonian about Liverpool. And it is critical, however, I hope it’s a bit more balanced and less bitter than your boy Tim, who was really upset. Firstly, I do want to say congratulations to Klopp and co for winning the league. Lots of praise for lots of reasons, the one area that I think has been a cut above the rest of the league is the transfer policy of computer nerd Michael Edwards and the coaching up of Klopp. They’ve bought Robertson and Winjaldum from relegated teams, and made them into European and league champions. The later big money signings of van Dijk and Allisson take the headlines, but they haven’t really had a transfer flop in the past few years. To do that, it’s not just about the scouting, but then the continuation to coach and transition that player into the squad, they do that exceptionally well. It is particularly galling that Everton don’t do this; with the scatter gun approach to transfers that seem led by agents and newspaper headlines – like when we got 3 slow “number 10s” in Sigurdsson, Klassen and Rooney in one summer. Similarly, when we do identify a good signing, we then don’t seem to turn that player around, as evidenced by our disjointed play before and after the lockdown break. It’s doubly disappointing as Everton used to be good at that under Moyes, with the examples of Jagielka, Baines, Pienaar, Arteta et al from that 2005-10 team that really should have won something.
And yet, they didn’t win anything, so Evertonians never had the chance to celebrate, so I’m in no position to judge and criticise Liverpool fans celebrating from Thursday and Friday, but I will. The scenes made me angry, like the scenes from Dorset and Bournemouth at a similar time, and 2 weeks earlier with the far-right/football lads demonstration in London. In all of those, it was the aftermath, in particular, that really wound me up, the rubbish left there, the disrespect for the surroundings, the drain on emergency services and key workers whilst we’re coming out of a pandemic. But the reason I’m picking on Liverpool fans and the reason why this has forced me to write into a football website, is because it was my city that was being disrespected in this manner.
I haven’t lived there since I left for university 16 years ago, and I only really go back for Christmas and important family events. I want more London based teams in the Premiership as it increases my opportunity for Everton games (come on up Fulham and Brentford!), but like many people who live away from where they were born or grew up, I’m incredibly proud of where I’m from. There’s the obvious stuff like The Beatles, the 2 cathedrals or the football rivalry, but also because of our understanding of history and tradition. I’d recommend, if you can, going to the International Slavery Museum – it’s a strong statement on honestly looking at your past critically and educating yourself. Liverpool knew that as well, there was so much stuff in the build up to the title win of how this would mean ‘a lot for the city’ and I believed that to be genuine.
The relationship the city has with football is deep and strong and a clear part of our identity. The investment the clubs make to the city is clear; from Fowler and the dockers shirt, to Evertons consistent and celebrated work with the community, and to the swift condemnation that Liverpool took for their decision on furloughing their non-playing staff – it all points to a recognition of how the football teams lie within the fabric of the city. The absolute pinnacle of this though, is how football fans were slandered in their death by a disgraceful media organisation, and the full rejection of this newspaper – which is sadly still the most read paper in the rest of the country – by the city. The relationship we have between two football teams can be trivial but it’s also powerful. When all football teams said they would play “You’ll Never Walk Alone” to honour the verdict at the Hillsborough trial in 2012, it did lead to concern of how Goodison would react to playing their rivals song. Hearing “He Ain’t Heavy, He’s My Brother” for that game at Goodison, still brings goosebumps to my skin and shows how a rivalry can be both loving and confrontational in a positive way.
I understand I don’t support a globally popular club, I support the other one. So when I criticize the Liverpool fans at the Pier Head on Friday night it can come across as bitter and nonsensical. I know a lot of people who do support Liverpool, and I’m genuinely fine that they were so happy on Thursday night; but I am upset that like other people have done over the past few weeks, it was used as an excuse for anti-social behaviour. It should, though, be pointed out that there was no reported trouble near Anfield on either night, and that those celebrations were held in good spirits.
So Liverpool fans; no one is denying the quality of the footballl you play nor the quality of your backroom staff – they’re world class. We do have a slight issue with the “This Means More” mantra which has proven to be a clumsy slogan and derogatory attitude with the furloughing and how the city centre looked on Saturday. And without wanting to come across as bitter, please don’t defend some wool from Scarisbrick setting fire to the Liver Building.
Cheers and congrats,
Matt, EFC, London
Just don’t respond?
Person 1: “Ha. I hate anyone who likes bananas. Bananas are rubbish. They look old after a few days, they turn to mush and their texture is terrible. Even though they’re “fruit of the year”, I think they’ll be squished next year and won’t even register as a fruit, they’re so bad. I like oranges. Anyone who likes bananas are stupid, pimply, pathetic wasters”.
Persons 2-10: “But here are some valid reasons why they’re great. They’re a fab colour. They’re versatile: you can cook them with chicken for that Southern States taste, you can pop them in with ice cream and they’re delicious too. Lord knows, I’ve been eating them for years and finally they’ve justifiably got the accolades they deserve”.
Person 1: “Ha, I’ve been surfing the crest of my banana hating ways for days now (probably because I got you all to reply to my banana hating vitriol). You’ve all replied and see – I was right to hate bananas. God I hate you all now more than ever. You banana loving bastards. You’re all the same you lot.”
Do yourselves a favour LFC fans, just don’t respond. That way there’ll just be one little person in the corner yelling “I hate bananas” to himself, and he’ll look even sillier when nobody replies.
Thanks to the lovely magnanimous fans of other teams – bet it was hard for some of you, so thanks anyway.
A long mail about a long malaise
I turned 30 during the lockdown and I’m fortunate/unfortunate to have spent those years as a Newcastle United fan. Firstly, congratulations to Manchester City – it feels a bit needless to say that you thoroughly deserved to go through, which is largely the point of this mail.
I watched the match yesterday with a good friend of mine who supports City. I say supports, but he’s very much in the “it was far more fun before the oil money arrived” camp. At first, it was great – City actually won the league! – but now it’s just about how many they’ll win by and there’s the big existential crisis about what’s paying for it. City winning a match doesn’t mean anything to him any more, because there’s no peril that they might lose.
Lets face it, this was Newcastle’s biggest game of the last three years. By the first drinks break, as I enthusiastically celebrated our sixteenth completed pass, we were discussing ridiculous ideas about how we could make it interesting as a sporting contest:
– “What if every time City scored, the referee sent off one of their players?”
– “Maybe every time City score, the ground staff wheel out a smaller goal for Newcastle and a bigger goal for City to extravagant fanfare”
At half time, we realised that if the goal City were defending had spanned from one corner flag to the other and been the size of the Leazes End stand, the half time score would’ve been Newcastle 1-1 City.
These teams are in the same division. There was a bigger gulf in quality between City and Newcastle than there was between Newcastle and Oxford United in the Fourth Round – and Newcastle are comfortably mid-table!
The single moment of excitement (from both of us) came as Dwight Gayle Ameobied that chance into the empty Gallowgate. A minute later it was done and you had the final part of the game played out with 21 players phoning it in, and Foden still tearing around desperately trying to prove he was any good.
At no point in the fortnight since football has resumed, the pre-match buildup or the game itself did I even remotely believe Newcastle United had any chance to win that football match. Martin Keown marvelled at the difference in quality between the team with a billion pounds of investment, and the team starved of meaningful investment for thirteen years. Soon it may change, and my team might become another of the oil-rich super clubs. I’m sure it’d be hilarious at first, but then I’d be left facing the same dilemma as my friend.
I probably sound really bitter; I’m genuinely not meaning to. It’s not a dig at City, who are an amazing team to watch. It’s not even a dig at Newcastle – I actually quite like Steve Bruce who seems like a lovely bloke keeping his head down, working hard and doing the best he can. You could argue that his game plan was sort of working if not for the silly penalty, and if he had a mildly competent striker. It’s a dig at the state of football. Let’s consider Allan Saint-Maximin, who’s our most exciting player. If he’s any good, he’ll be signed up to sit on Chelsea’s bench by the end of next season. If he’s not, well then we remain where we are, striving desperately to finish somewhere between 11th and 14th.
I suppose I’m wondering if this feeling is the same for fans of other mid-table clubs? I’m hoping this is just a result of the malaise of lockdown; that I’ve found it difficult to pick up interest in the season again after such a long break. I think I miss the Championship where we had something to play for, against other teams on a similar level. Sure, the football was ‘terrible’ but is the football really any better now? But maybe I miss the Championship because we were winning every week.
The big, inescapable irony of the whole thing is that I’m super stoked for Formula 1 to return this week, a sport with exactly the same problem. The Premier League has twenty teams, but six have a realistic chance at winning. F1 has ten teams; three have any realistic chance at winning. The difference? I’m a Lewis Hamilton fan, he has the best car, he therefore has a good chance of winning every week. This makes me a big stinking hypocrite.
But the point is that sport is considerably more engaging to watch when your favourite team/athlete has a chance to succeed. Currently, yer man Hamilton has an unfair chance to succeed because his team is one of three that has far more resources and money than the other seven. If he ends up behind a car from a lower team, he just breezes past in a few laps. F1 is (to their rare credit) introducing a budget cap and small advantages/perks to teams that finish lower down the final standings. It’ll be very interesting to see if it has a significant sporting effect, and it’d be great if it did because it’d be much better to watch a season where maybe six or seven of the teams could compete to win if they performed well.
Do I think the Premier League would be better if you started a season with ten or twelve teams having a chance of qualifying for the European places? Absolutely yes, doesn’t even have to be my team that’s one of those twelve. But perhaps I’m living in a big John Nicholson fantasy socialist land and I should shut up and accept that actually, Newcastle would be lucky to finish 13th and honestly my expectations are really deluded.
That turned into quite a long mail. So, in summary:
Newcastle weren’t great.
Greg (all hail Steve Bruce’s Football Revolution), NUFC in Leeds
Regarding the article on Men’s football being too homophobic for players to ‘come out’, I think it’s more basic than that. I believe it’s simply down to the rudimentary tribalism of football fans that targets anything different. I don’t know if it’s the Twitter age or it’s been going on longer than I remember but football seems a lot angrier than it used to be, outside of the obvious hooligan factions, and it’s just about hating the opposition and, if that means targeting a single player, regardless of your usual morals, then so be it.
I believe there are many football fans who aren’t essentially homophobic, that may have gay friends and family members, but would target a gay footballer with abuse solely on the basis of tribalism.
What’s more is that it probably wouldn’t get called out either. Where if someone saw someone on the street being verbally abused they might step in, I think they’d be much less inclined in the stands.
We’ve seen just this week the celebrations of the Liverpool fans at the Pier Head. I’m a Liverpool fan and, where I think those attending were inconsiderate, I kind of get it, however those firing the fireworks at the Liver buildings I find deplorable, along with the actions of many reds who just caused trouble and brought shame on our fanbase. What I noticed were two things: firstly a lot of excusing and deflecting from Liverpool fans when it was called out, and secondly a lot of hyperbolic vitriol from opposition fans who are, quite evidently, only acting so sanctimonious because of their dislike for LFC.
This tribalism runs deep, its flames fanned by the angrier, louder voices in the crowds and on social media that makes more timid fans believe that’s how they have to be to really support their team.
My initial thought is that this is probably impossible to eradicate, and so it will forever be incredibly difficult to ‘normalise’ homosexuality within men’s football although I’d love to be wrong.
Paul, The Wirral
Thoughts with Stu and his family
Opening the Mailbox this morning and read that heart breaking mail from Stu, it puts life into perspective truly, first I am like many who read the mail so sorry to hear about the passing of your father, truly tragic, hope you and your family are coping as best as can be during this time, I am sure I speak for the whole of the Mailbox community and Football365 when I say our condolences and thoughts are with you all at this awful time in your lives.
Just a follow-up mail to say thank you for the words of support. In a world that seems to get increasingly darker, I’m touched by the well wishes of our football community.
Love to you all, and thank you so much again.